Where is it going?

WannaBe · Wiggles Joined: 22 Oct 2004 Posts: 714 Location: CA

Programmer's Corner has been around for over 4 years now; with many additions, changes and removals to help create this site a best of a community. At first Programmer's Corner showed senses of lifeless in 2005. As I slightly remember someone remarking that the site dies down during times of the year do to school/job events schedule the same each year. Creating the “Advisory Committee” category in the forums helped put focus on making improvements for the new 2006-7 years. Yet after a greatly few focused topics/threads of the many different methods of improvement it all stopped. Nothing was even really added, other than color scheme changes.

I created this topic to hope to ask a question, to the current owner of Programmer's Corner and to get a reasonable answer. Where is Programmer's Corner going? I know everyone here doesn't always have time, due to school, jobs, and families; but a dead site is nothing more than an useless site. It provides nothing onces it is only outdated do to its dynamic content only becoming static.

I hope to also encourage you (the owner) to consider to either provide the access for trustworthy users of this site able to improve this site with the few things listed under the “Advisory Committee” category, or resign your ownership to someone else; willing to take some time to keep this site in a dynamic state.

I for-one am willing to be this person, even though I wasn't a member since day one; nor the most knowledgeable of this site. After witnessing more than a few constant-members leave, slight remarks on the forums of its state and no content submissions since November 2006; I just can't sit quietly any longer, and I hope you understand.

Thanks,
Daniel Story.

theraje · Cap'n Arr! Joined: 22 Oct 2004 Posts: 262

I have to agree. This site has been left to stagnate for the last couple years, and it's discouraging. Programmer's Corner has a lot of potential that could be realized if some changes were made. The only thing new that happens around here is spam and the infrequent (unanswered) programming question. This place has become little more than roadkill on the information superhighway.

I'm sure Wannabe and I are not alone in wanting to see some new life come to P-C. Whether or not that happens relies heavily upon the owner, and if the current owner can't or won't do anything, I say he should pass it on to someone who can and will.

Hrqls · Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2007 9:41 am Post subject:

hi!

i occasionally visit this board to see if there are any questions to be answered .. or any fun stuff

this would also be the first site i would post something when i make something new which others could benefit from as well

the success of a site depends on its traffic though .. and its traffic depends somewhat (or more Smile

) on the dynamics of the site

it would be nice if this site could be revived .. there was a good old bunch of regulars which knows a lot .. with the possibility to become a great site again

Shaldares · Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2007 10:07 am Post subject:

You guys know I'm with you in trying to get this site back up and running, as I've tried to get this forum back up to running normally again, but haven't had much success. As much as I hate to say it and don't want to be responsible for having to say it, but wannabe may be right. Confused

blcArmadillo · Samurai++ Joined: 04 Mar 2005 Posts: 85 Location: Michigan

Hey guys I hope your successful in an attempt to revitalize programmers corner. Every once and awhile I come back to check if the site is still around and if anyone has posted. And as wannabe and others have pointed out, there are never any new posts. I know programmers corner definitely has potential though. Any time I've ever put a post up on this site I've gotten quick posts and on top of that the replies have always been helpful. Some times someone points out what I did wrong other times one of the users takes the time to literally rewrite my code so I can see how I should have done it. All this help programmers corner users have given me has definitely made me a better coder. Thanks programmers corner users. I hope you and other users are successful in you attempts to help programmers corner wannabe. If you guys need any help let me know. I'm a full time student so during the school year its not likely I can do much, but I'm free in the summers.

Algorithms · Dragon Joined: 21 Oct 2004 Posts: 343 Location: Florida

I too check in to see if new posts have happened. Or to see if the current broken layout has been fixed. An injection of live in to PC would be much welcomed. I miss the community. I think we are all to blame in some way for it going stale, but the sites layout being broken and front page barely working I am sure doesn't help.

I wouldn't be able to contribute much in the way of time to help deploy a new site, but I'd definitely be back in the forums helping where I could if the site was showing signs of life again.

I would do what I could though if this indeed moves forward. I'd like to see this site back in its prime.

/signed

Eric · Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2007 3:19 pm Post subject:

I might be able to help some. But not much. Life is pretty busy, and I only have time for so many projects.

But, if you do want to get PC going again, you need a couple of things.

Someone dedicated to organizing things.
A good business model.
New content - on a regular basis (at least weekly).

You need a business model to handle how the site will generate revenue. Even if the only revenue is enough to cover operating expenses. But I would try to generate enough revenue to buy gifts for contests, and to pay contributors. Either in prizes or cash (I'd do gift cards to Amazon and such).

You need content on a regular basis. The last sets of new contents was from eons ago. Most people don't regularly hang out on programming websites. They come, grab what they need (article, source code snippet, answer via forum) and then leave. You need regular fresh content to keep people visiting (doesn't matter if it's the same folks, or new folks).

Well, that's my $0.02. Hope it wasn't too dark for anyone. I think PC could be a player... but it's going to take more work than I can contribute... Beyond a couple of articles or source code, I probably won't be able to help much.

natriss102 · Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2007 4:02 pm Post subject:

Hey guys! Remember when I got that Zune?

Anyway, I've migrated from one forum to another and been able to get some pretty successful stuff going.
PC's just kind of there, and I agree that no new content is, at best, discouraging. Me thinks that while we have quality service, the small demographic we cater too is rather sparse and desolate for such a struggling website such as PC.

I'll try to promote the site as much as I can to those looking to program, and make this a more frequent hotspot for me to chill

Also, I wouldn't be abject to the idea of creating our own little version of the High-Q (See: http://www.zuneboards.com/forums/high-q-100/ my own little creation [I'm Dizzy]).

If anything were to be done, I think a new skin should be first on the list. This one just screams dull. Razz

BTW: I've forgotten how much the smilies here kick ass.

EDIT:
And Dan, you get my vote. You should see what this guy's been doing in his free time. Crazy.

Shaldares · Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2007 4:20 pm Post subject:

You know, one thing I've begun to realize reading all these posts, is that as much as it'd be nice to have Adam here working on the site, that's not the only problem. We have a few people here keeping the posts active, but not enough. We also post, but don't really talk about anything. I think revamping the lounge with the high-q thing (or something similar) is a good idea. Either way, I think we should use this thread or a new thread to post ideas to make this place more interesting and fun.

natriss102 · Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2007 4:27 pm Post subject:

Exactly. I think if we get excited about it, other people will too Very Happy

bdi · Nobody Joined: 21 Oct 2004 Posts: 1646 Location: Chicago

So, I thought I'd add a few points for you all here...

First off, I won't speak for Adam, but he's not interested in rebuilding the site. Look at the obvious, if he were interested he would have already done it. Whether he is willing to pass the site off or sell it off to someone else, that's between you and him, I'll stay out of that.

Despite being the person who is sorriest of all to see the site in shambles (for obvious reasons), I'll face the facts that it probably won't be changing anytime soon. So, my following thoughts will focus on anyone wanting to create their own new site for programmer's.

First, I'll plug what Eric said. A content site needs someone willing to spend some time on it to get it started. You need to setup layouts, setup databases with forms for entry, and methods to handle spam. Once you have the tools, you need the content. You can't count on anyone else for content. If you are unwilling or lack the resources to add content yourself then don't bother starting a site like this. I would suggest you consider that you need at least 1 new article/tutorial a week.

Once the site is setup, SEO is your best friend. I don't know recent stats, but the main content pages always got FAR more visitors than the forums.

A business plan is also important. Programmer's Corner has already figured this out with the ads in the content (HINT: see the square ones in the articles/tutorials). Of course, finding new and unique ways to keep people around is always important too. One of my failings when I was at the top of P-C was not putting the effort toward keeping people. Contests and such will not only keep people around, but it will create some buzz and have people bring their friends.

Finally, I am going to say somthing counter to the previous few posts. While you might be interested in expanding the lounge, the forums need to stay on focus with the site. Part of the business plan has to be identifying your target audience, bringing them in, and bringing them back. The lounge gives people a place to visit, but it does not bring your target audience which will make use of the forums for the purpose they are intended: learning programming. You need to keep the site on focus. One of the shortcomings of P-C is a lack of focus. If you visit other sites the entire site concentrates in one area of programming, or the site is segmented off to create well defined segments for the different programming styles.

Alright, that's my 2 cents. Between Eric and I we are almost up to a gumball!

natriss102 · Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2007 5:31 pm Post subject:

Sounds like you know more then I do (and I'm sure you do)

In my (little) experience, I find that building a community where people know each other, respect each other, and have fun together is as important as anything else

Shaldares · Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2007 5:47 pm Post subject:

In my (little as well) experience and opinion, I think you both have good points. While you obviously can't have a good programming site and get aspiring/experienced programmers without the material, people aren't going to stay if there's nothing else there to do. People will come when they need something, and then leave when they get it. If you have a good place to just chat, more people will stay and will thus the content will expand even more, however if you focus too much on the lounge and not enough on the programming, you'll lose the more knowledgeable members who are here to program and help program. There has to be a balance in there.

theraje · Cap'n Arr! Joined: 22 Oct 2004 Posts: 262

Has no one considered the possibility of "merging" the lounge and the programming stuff, by making a site that focuses on the programming industry/culture rather than how-to's. For instance, we could have news, then couple it with blogs that comment on the news (and the current state of things in software development), as well as editorials and articles (the one Eric wrote at the beginning comparing VB to McDonald's is a good example of what I have in mind), and let people comment on those things. That way, we have content, and the community is built around that content. It's sort of like an interactive magazine for programmers.

That's my 2 cents (now we need to find someone with a nickel since the gumball machines won't take pennies...).

Ankou · Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2007 8:34 pm Post subject:

I wanted to post this morning but was running late for work... so now I can finally toss in my 2 cents (actually it'll be like 1 cent since a lot of what I was thinking has been covered).

I agree that it's up to Adam and those interested in taking over if he wants to hand over control (or sell it).

I originally wanted to say, "Why not just start a new site?" But looking at the big pictures I can see why getting PC back up and running would make more sense. First, it's less work to revive the site as opposed to starting a new site. There's the content, the traffic, the reputation of the site ... etc.

I'd agree that it may be a good idea to pass the torch. But that's not my call to make. If Adam doesn't want to pass the torch I respect that... it's his call and I wouldn't ask for reasons from him.

You know the funny thing is that PC is still here, there's no reason that it can't be revived without passing along ownership. Shaldares has been trying to do that already... maybe all that needs to be done is to start adding new content and posting more in other forums. Plus if someone were to really focus on doing that ... who knows maybe it would make the idea of passing the torch a bit easier...

Eric · Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2007 8:55 pm Post subject:

OK. How about this...

A couple of you (anyone interested in really being a backbone of the new site), write up some business models. How do you plan on making the site truly self supportive?

Give yourself a target budget (say $100 a month to start). How do you plan on making that money? How do you plan on attracting new people? How do you plan on bring existing folks back?

Then people can all submit their model, and the models are merged and fine-tuned into one model. Then work can begin on the site.

Of course, this is all hinged on Adam turning the site over to someone (or allowing a group to monetize things to make it self supportive).

In the meantime, why not write some tutorials and articles? A lot of people want PC to live... but nobody is donating any blood...

WannaBe · Wiggles Joined: 22 Oct 2004 Posts: 714 Location: CA

WannaBe · Wiggles Joined: 22 Oct 2004 Posts: 714 Location: CA

Shaldares · Posted: Tue Dec 18, 2007 9:33 am Post subject:

Ankou · Posted: Tue Dec 18, 2007 6:19 pm Post subject: